GoT 32 - Not today..

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# 75
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Не смятам, че тези статуи действително съществуват - с изключение на статуите на Нед и Лиана, за които знаем, че ги има.

Да, предполагам, както лицата в храма на безликите от тийзъра на непомнякой сезон. Peace

Горкият Джон, с леля си или с първата си братовчедка. Sick
По-добре с Церсей  Mr. Green.
Но тъй като сценаристите нямат проблем с инцеста, предпочитам да изберат Санса.
Аз предпочитам да изберат Аря в такъв случай. Чисто визуално са по-подходяща партия. Но не мисля, че ще се стигне дотам.

# 76
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По-добре първа братовчедка, отколкото с леля си

# 77
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И аз предпочитам Санса. Благодаря за разясненията за Бран, както и за различните прочети на тийзъра. Обичам да чета такива неща, защото не съм чак толкова вътре в сериала, както някои тук Simple Smile

# 78
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И аз Санса предпочитам.
Какви предположения имате-кой ще оцелее?
Залагам ,че Старките ще се спасят.
Церсей и Юрон ги пиша пътници.
За Джайм и Тирион се чудя.

# 79
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Иска ми се да оцелеят Джон и Санса.   Praynig
Надявам се да оцелее Джон.  Hug
Възможно е да оцелее Церсей.  Mr. Green
Много лесно избиват главните герои.  Sick
Да не остане накрая само Бран, който всъщност вече не е Бран.  Confused

# 80
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Aз на Краля на Нощта залагам. Grinning Идея нямам, убедена съм, че ще се развият нещата по най- неочаквания начин.
Санса, така и не можах да я харесам. Беше ми ужасно антипатична в началото с глезенето си и прехласването си по Джофри. Разви се персонажът й, но все пак не  достатъчно, за да й симпатизирам.
Денерис, я харесвам по принцип, но имам усещането, че ще развалят и нея. Grinning На финала, ако оцелее, като нищо ще е станала като лудия си предшественик.
Чудно ми е, къде се загуби и Дух. Четох, че щял да се завърне в последния сезон, но дано обяснят по някакъв начин изчезването му.

# 81
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И аз Санса предпочитам.
Какви предположения имате-кой ще оцелее?
Залагам ,че Старките ще се спасят.
Церсей и Юрон ги пиша пътници.
За Джайм и Тирион се чудя.

 Попаднах на интересни разсъждения за Джайм като Ръка на краля. Може би съм пристрастна, защото той ми е сред най-любимите герои, а бях го отписала - смятах, че ще умре заедно с Церсей.
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В книгите Ръката на краля носи верига, а в сериала - ето това:

Което много напомня на ето това:

 

On season one we were literally told by Tyrion Lannister on episode 1, that Jaime was the handsome brother and that Tyrion was the smart one. That of course, its not a lie, but I do think it was a way for books and show to deceives us, to overestimate Tyrion’s intelligence and underestimate Jaime’s capability as a leader and as a judge of human character.



In his first scene with Cersei she tells him that he should be the Hand and Jaime remarks that its a honor that he could live without and makes a joke telling her that its a job that requires long days. Remember Jaime always uses jokes to deflect insecurance or frustration. I actually think he likes the idea.


When they are preparing for the feast in the evening Jaime goes after Tyrion who is in a brothel with some whores. Jaime shows up and tells him to get ready for the party. “The Starks are feasting us this evening, please dont leave me alone with those people”. This was the QUOTE that got my attention. For some reason this line was shinning like a big foreshadowing to me.

I expect the Jon and the Starks to rule the kingdom in the end and a new time, a time for wolves to start in Westeros by the end of this story, and I think Jaime will be the last Lannister left to restore his House.


On episode 2, we have Jaime taking Jon right hand and thanking him for taking the black and joining the Nights Watch. They even make sure to pan the camera on Jaime taking Jon’s hand.



When Ned Stark arrives in Kings Landing Jaime is in the Throne room to receive him. He makes a joke about Ned being the hand of the King “how do they say it? the King shits and the Hand cleans it?
Again, he is making another joke and mocking Ned Stark, but I think he is a bit jealous, he wanted the job, but people dont think he is serious enough for such position. Nobody taks him seriously, no even his family.


In the Robert and Cersei scene where they discuss their marriage, once again there is the idea of Jaime being the hand of the King. Robert says that he will make Jaime his hand, but Cersei knows tells him that Jaime is not serious enough for the job.


Robert goes see Ned and orders him to put back the badge of hand of the King or he will put the badge on JAIME LANNISTER and make him the Hand of the King!!!


Finally, on episode 7 when Tywin Lannister is later introduced to the story. In this scene  he asks Jaime to become the man he was supposed to be. And that for me it will be Jaime arc on season 8.




On season one we were literally told by Tyrion Lannister on episode 1, that Jaime was the handsome brother and that Tyrion was the smart one. That of course, its not a lie, but I do think it was a way for books and show to deceives us, to overestimate Tyrion’s intelligence and underestimate Jaime’s capability as a leader and as a judge of human character. Jaime was the one who told to Jory on S1 E4 how dangerous Theon seemed to be for House Stark and what a risk his was for the family, while Tyrion could only mock the way Theon talked about his masters. Jaime proved to be the one right since later Theon would betray House Stark and take Winterfell.
Jaime completely outsmarted Tyrion in season 7 using the mistakes he made in the past as a lesson.

Jaime and Jon were literally the two leaders on season 7 trying to save their people from unecessary deaths. He went to Cersei to tells her that they couldnt win against Dragons, he wanted her to surrender to Dany to save the lives of his armies and his people; he decided to abandon her to go fight North and save the realm. He is finally becoming the man he is supposed to be.

And that quote from Jon in season 7 also made me think of him and Jaime "my father used to say, we find our true friends in the battlefield". I think Jon and Jaime will forge a nice relationship in season 8 and Jon will need someone with experience in Kings Landing. Jaime lived his whole life in the capital and watched his father and Jon Arryn being hands of the king for decades. He will help Jon to be a better king.
Jon and Tyrion were friends of summer; Jaime and Jon will become frinds during winter. “Summer friends will melt away like summer snows, but winter friends are friends forever.”

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1) A chain of hands - the sign of office for the Hand

The most obvious foreshadowing derives from the fact that in the books the sign of office for the Hand is a chain of golden hands that entwine. The Hand wears it round his neck.

And in ACOK and ASOS this chain plays a very prominent role, since Shae, Tyrion’s girlfriend/whore is obsessed with it. Later Tyrion strangles her with this chain when he finds her in his father’s bed with the chain around the neck.

Laughing, she stroked the chain. "I wanted some hands on my titties … but these little gold ones are cold.” (ACOK, Tyrion XII)

A chain of linked golden hands was half-buried in the flesh of her throat, twisted so tight that it had broken the skin. (AFFC, Cersei I)

ASOS where Tyrion chokes Shae – which draws attention to the chain – is also the same book where we see Jaime losing his hand and wearing his own rotting hand around his neck for quite some time. Now, Jaime’s hand around his neck might mirror Tyrion’s story in a twisted way, but that does not rule out that it is a foreshadowing for Jaime himself.

His hand was always between them. Urswyck had hung it about his neck on a cord, so it dangled down against his chest, slapping Brienne’s breasts as Jaime slipped in and out of consciousness. (ASOS, Jaime IV)

I want to draw your attention to the fact that this repeats the hands on Shae’s breasts! And all because Jaime and Brienne sit on the horse facing each other.

I do think the following is even better:

 "You have lost a hand.“

"No,” said Jaime, “I have it here, hanging round my neck.” (ASOs, Jaime IV)

 This is a typical Jaime quip which could be foreshadowing in disguise.

This motive of the rotting hand is reiterated later in AFFC, when Jaime stands watch at Tywin’s bier:

The King’s Hand was rotting visibly. His face had taken on a greenish tinge, and his eyes were deeply sunken, two black pits. Fissures had opened in his cheeks, and a foul white fluid was seeping through the joints of his splendid gold-and-crimson armor to pool beneath his body. (AFFC, Jaime I)

Jaime even connects the rotting Hand with his own memory.

I have smelled my own hand rotting, when Vargo Hoat made me wear it for a pendant. (AFFC, Jaime I)

So Tywin’s corpse rotting is connected to Jaime’s rotting hand. There are several reasons why GRRM chooses to let Tywin rot so fast. It stands for his legacy which will fall apart fast after his death, but I find the connection to Jaime’s “rotting hand chain” very interesting.

Jaime is again tied to Tywin’s ‘hand’ later when he is in the Riverlands:

Everywhere Jaime looked he saw his father’s hand, even in the bones they sometimes glimpsed beside the road. (ADWD, Jaime I)

2) Connections of foreshadowing in the Lannister PoVs

I would argue that Tyrion’s arc in ACOK and ASOS and Jaime’s chapters are connected and foreshadow parts of their respective futures.

In ACOK we have several scenes in Tyrion’s chapters where the loss of a hand is alluded to, and considering that Tyrion is Hand in ACOK, I don’t think it is too far-fetched to suppose that Tyrion’s story does allude to plot points in Jaime’s arc and the loss of his hand in ASOS.

“Ser Alliser Thorne?” Of all the black brothers he’d met on the Wall, Tyrion Lannister had liked Ser Alliser Thorne the least. A bitter, mean-spirited man with too great a sense of his own worth. “Come to think on it, I don’t believe I care to see Ser Alliser just now. Find him a snug cell where no one has changed the rushes in a year, and let his hand rot a little more.” (ACOK, Tyrion IV)

“I yield, ser,” a different knight called out, farther down the river. “Yield. Ser knight, I yield to you. My pledge, here, here.” The man lay in a puddle of black water, offering up a lobstered gauntlet in token of submission. Tyrion had to lean down to take it from him. As he did, a pot of wildfire burst overhead, spraying green flame. In the sudden stab of light he saw that the puddle was not black but red. The gauntlet still had the knight’s hand in it. He flung it back. “Yield,” the man sobbed hopelessly, helplessly. Tyrion reeled away. (ACOK, Tyrion XIV)

Apart from that Tyrion makes a certain Jacelyn Bywater Ironhand the commander of the city watch, a man with one hand who has an Ironhand placed above his stump. Keep him in mind!

So, Tyrion’s chapter foreshadow Jaime’s hand loss and in a reverse way, we have some foreshadowing in Jaime’s chapter that Tyrion will lose his tongue, and outcome that might happen. Tyrion is very often threatened with the loss of his tongue that we might see him lose it. There was a post on reddit/ASOIAF about Tyrion’s loss of tongue (x). It would mean that all the Lannisters lose the thing that defines them, Cersei her beauty, Jaime his hand, Tyrion his tongue.

This little tidbit in Jaime’s arc might foretell Tyrion’s loss of tongue

Unchain my hands and I’ll play mute all the way to King’s Landing. (ASOS, Jaime III)

Ser Illyn Payne plays a prominent role in Jaime’s arc and his presence might insinuate further his loss of tongue, just to give one example:

Aerys had Ser Ilyn Payne’s tongue torn out just for boasting that it was the Hand who truly ruled the Seven Kingdoms. The captain of the Hand’s guard, and yet Father dared not try and stop it! (ASOS,  Jaime II)

This also makes me suspect that Jaime probably will be powerless to stop Tyrion losing his clever tongue.

In regard to the three Lannister siblings, t is interesting that for Cersei “hand” has a very different connotation. Because of the prophecy of the Valonqar it fills her with fear and dread, she had nightmares about hands and in ADWD even her tormentors the septas of the faith let her feel their hands:

His merriment still echoed in her ears when she felt a light touch on her shoulder, and woke suddenly. For half a heartbeat the hand seemed part of the nightmare, and Cersei cried out, but it was only Senelle.  (AFFC, Cersei I)

“I know.” She thought of Joffrey, clawing at his neck. In his last moments he had looked to her in desperate appeal, and a sudden memory had stopped her heart; a drop of red blood hissing in a candle flame, a croaking voice that spoke of crowns and shrouds, of death at the hands of the valonqar. (AFFC, Cersei VI)

The valonqar shall wrap his hands about your throat, the queen heard, but the voice did not belong to the old woman. The hands emerged from the mists of her dream and coiled around her neck; thick hands, and strong. Above them floated his face, leering down at her with his mismatched eyes. No, the queen tried to cry out, but the dwarf’s fingers dug deep into her neck, choking off her protests. She kicked and screamed to no avail. Before long she was making the same sound her son had made, the terrible thin sucking sound that marked Joff’s last breath on earth. (AFFC, Cersei VIII)

Wake and sleep and wake again, every night was broken into pieces by the rough hands of her tormentors, and every night was colder and crueler than the night before. (ADWD, Cersei I)

But it is not only the nightmarish hands of he Valonqar who frighten and threaten Cersei, it is also the King’s Hands who make her life a misery:

She wanted to slap him again for that. I must have been mad to think he could be Hand. She would sooner abolish the office. When had a Hand ever brought her anything but grief? Jon Arryn put Robert Baratheon in her bed, and before he died he’d begun sniffing about her and Jaime as well. Eddard Stark took up right where Arryn had left off; his meddling had forced her to rid herself of Robert sooner than she would have liked, before she could deal with his pestilential brothers. Tyrion sold Myrcella to the Dornishmen, made one of her sons his hostage, and murdered the other. And when Lord Tywin returned to King’s Landing … (AFFC, Cersei I)

So Hands and hands do not bode well for Cersei, and Jaime’s loss of hand certainly was the beginning of her disconnection to her twin. But there is another intersting foreshadowing about Cersei’s death.

Gold, yes, but the moment Cersei took it she could tell that it was wrong. Too small, she thought, too thin. The coin was old and worn. On one side was a king’s face in profile, on the other side the imprint of a hand. “This is no dragon,” she said. (AFFC, Cersei II)

These are the coins found in Tyrion’s cell which lead Cersei to believe in a Tyrell conspiracy. It should be noted that in a way these coins are “golden hands” like Jaime’s “new hand” and like the hands from the chain of office.

I still think it is possible that Cersei will be choked to death only figuratively by the hand of a younger sibling, but it is interesting to see how the hand-motive connects the three siblings.

3) Show evidence for the sign of office

The chain of hands reproduced in a grizzly way in the hand hung around Jaime’s neck does not occur in the show, but it is interesting that the hand pin that is the sign of office in the show has a strong similarity to the golden hand that is made for Jaime.

4) Other hints thrown at the reader

But apart from this there are also other hints. I’m as yet undecided if I think they are conclusive, but they are interesting:

Ser Cleos shoved the oar into Jaime’s hand and scrambled aft. (ASOS, Jaime I)

A ship/boat is often figurately used as a metaphor for a kingdom/state and I think it is interesting that this little tidbit shows up in Jaime’s very first PoV chapter.

Lord Bolton turned his pale eyes on Vargo Hoat. “I am displeased. By that, and this of Ser Jaime’s hand.” (ASOS, Jaime IV)

I just included this for completeness’ sake. Ser Jaime’s hand might be read as Ser Jaime is hand, but you might call this reaching

“King’s Landing,” Jaime announced when he found her. “Our journey’s done, my lady. You’ve kept your vow, and delivered me to King’s Landing. All but a few fingers and a hand.” (ASOS, Jaime VII)

So, Brienne delivers a Hand to King’s Landing…

The most convincing to me is the following, though:

Rhaegar had put his hand on Jaime’s shoulder. “When this battle’s done I mean to call a council. Changes will be made. I meant to do it long ago, but … well, it does no good to speak of roads not taken. We shall talk when I return.” (AFFC, Jaime I)

I do think the wording is suspicious here: It could easily have been something like this: Rhaegar took him aside or something similar, no, but he puts his hand on Jaime’s shoulder. I’ve long held the belief that we will see another Great Council before the end (which would be the third Great Council) and it would stand to reason that the Great Council decides on a compromise which would mean that House Lannister would have to be appeased, and the Hand job might do this.

There is even a phrase in one of Catelyn’s chapters that might allude to Jaime as hand. This is when she comes to the imprisoned Jaime:

As for your Ned, he should have kissed the hand that slew Aerys, but he preferred to scorn the arse he found sitting on Robert’s throne. I think Ned Stark loved Robert better than he ever loved his brother or his father .(ACOK, Catelyn VII)

Jaime sitting on the Throne is a very interesting scene anyway. We know that the Hand sits on the throne when the king is absent, and Jaime sitting on the throne and Ned coming upon him might foreshadow another ‘Stark’ coming and Jaime as his hand.

“I could not save Ser Jaime’s hand, it is true. My arts saved his arm, however, mayhaps his very life. The Citadel took my chain, but they could not take my knowledge.” (AFFC, Cersei I)

I put this here, because the close connection of hand and chain again might allude to a swap of a hand/Hand and a chain (of hands).

“The riverlands have need of a strong hand, my father says.” (AFFC, Cersei II)

And the riverlands are where Jaime is sent.

And here is one I like especially.

“Ser Jaime is at his armorer’s being fitted for a hand. “ (AFFC, Cersei IV)

I want to draw attention to the fact that this phrase is voiced by a certain Aurane Waters in Cersei’s council , a man who reminds Cersei of Rhaegar and who in part serves as a stand-in for Jon Snow in King’s Landing. (cf. on this my post on Cersei and Aurane Waters)

5) Jaime being repeatedly suggested for the Hand job (and dismissed as unfit, even by himself)

The Job of Hand is naturally often discussed in AFFC and occasionally Jaime is put forward to the job, not only in the scenes from season 1 (who at least in part also happen in the books, like Robert threatening to give Jaime the job of the Hand if Ned declines again)

Cersei wants him to do it at the beginning of AFFC:

 "Be my Hand,” she pleaded, “and we’ll rule the Seven Kingdoms together, like a king and his queen.” (AFFC, Jaime I)

But that it is not the only time Jaime as hand is discussed, we see it from Cersei’s perspective as well:

Jaime hugged her, his good hand pressing against the small of her back. He smelled of ash, but the morning sun was in his hair, giving it a golden glow. She wanted to draw his face to hers for a kiss. Later, she told herself, later he will come to me, for comfort. “We are his heirs, Jaime,” she whispered. “It will be up to us to finish his work. You must take Father’s place as Hand. You see that now, surely. Tommen will need you …”

He pushed away from her and raised his arm, forcing his stump into her face. “A Hand without a hand? A bad jape, sister. Don’t ask me to rule.”

Their uncle heard the rebuff. Qyburn as well, and the Kettleblacks, wrestling their bundle through the ashes. Even the guardsmen heard, Puckens and Hoke the Horseleg and Shortear. It will be all over the castle by nightfall. Cersei felt the heat rising up her cheeks. “Rule? I said naught of ruling. I shall rule until my son comes of age.” (AFFC, Cersei I)

Cersei soon comes to the conclusion that Jaime doesn’t make a good hand:

“You need a Hand,“ he [Kevan] said, "and Jaime has refused you.” He is blunt. Very well. “Jaime … I felt so lost with Father dead, I scarce knew what I was saying. Jaime is gallant, but a bit of a fool, let us be frank. Tommen needs a more seasoned man. Someone older …” … “Jaime … Jaime has taken vows. Jaime never thinks, he laughs at everything and everyone and says whatever comes into his head. Jaime is a handsome fool.”

“And yet he was your first choice to be the King’s Hand. What does that make you, Cersei?” “I told you, I was sick with grief, I did not think—” (AFFC, Cersei II)

Jaime is put forward as hand a lot in the first chapters of AFFC, more times than I quoted here. Maybe he is not ready yet? It is not the right king yet?

Jaime doesn’t want to do the job himself, but he knows that they need a good hand:

If Cersei can be put aside, Ser Kevan may agree to serve as Tommen’s Hand. And if not, well, the Seven Kingdoms did not lack for able men. Forley Prester would make a good choice, or Roland Crakehall. If someone other than a westerman was needed to appease the Tyrells, there was always Mathis Rowan … or even Petyr Baelish. Littlefinger was as amiable as he was clever, but too lowborn to threaten any of the great lords, with no swords of his own. The perfect Hand. (AFFC, Jaime VII)

I stronly disagree with Jaime…. Littlefinger would be a disaster as hand. Jaime himself though as the last Lannister would still be a great lord, but he might still be a good choice because he has “no sword of his own”. It is telling that Jaime doesn’t think about himself as hand.

6) Would Jaime be a good Hand?

Jaime witnessed quite a lot of hands during his stay at Aerys’ court:

Instead of being together, Cersei and Jaime just changed places, and he found himself alone at court, guarding a mad king while four lesser men took their turns dancing on knives in his father’s ill-fitting shoes. So swiftly did the Hands rise and fall that Jaime remembered their heraldry better than their faces. The horn-of-plenty Hand and the dancing griffins Hand had both been exiled, the mace-and-dagger Hand dipped in wildfire and burned alive. Lord Rossart had been the last. His sigil had been a burning torch; an unfortunate choice, given the fate of his predecessor, but the alchemist had been elevated largely because he shared the king’s passion for fire. I ought to have drowned Rossart instead of gutting him. (ASOS, Jaime II)

So, he has seen quite a few hands in action, and although he is a ‘slow learner’ as by his own words that might mean that he really takes his lessons to heart.

I think it is also interesting that the show introduced Jaime as dyslexic, a detail not in book canon. This oddly ties Jaime to Davos, Stannis’ Hand of shortened fingers (on this cf. point 10 later) who is in the beginning even unable to read and write. I think this is a curious parallel and it might have been done on purpose considering that it is mentioned in season 3, when D&D allegedly had been informed on the endgame.

We see Jaime acting for the King in the Riverlands in AFFC, and although his actions are pretty grey, we see in his head that he really wants to pacify the Riverlands.

7) Will Jaime be happy about being the Hand?

I don’t think so. Jaime remaining on this earth while his siblings are gone, might be a case of “You don’t get your wish!” or “You, Susan, you stay!”.

There is a hint that it won’t be the thing Jaime wants:

Jaime’s hands wrapped around the chain that bound his wrists, and he twisted it taut, wishing for the strength to snap it in two. (ASOS, Jaime II)

There is also the dream Jaime has at a weirwood which like the line “Don’t leave me alone with these people” foreshadows that Jaime indeed might be the Last Lannister:

Relief made him dizzy. My hand, my good hand. Nothing could hurt him so long as he was whole…. (ASOS, Jaime VI)

Jaime of the one hand gets a hand back in this dream which is rich with foreshadowing.

 "Your place.“ The voice echoed; it was a hundred voices, a thousand, the voices of all the Lannisters since Lann the Clever, who’d lived at the dawn of days. But most of all it was his father’s voice, and beside Lord Tywin stood his sister, pale and beautiful, a torch burning in her hand. Joffrey was there as well, the son they’d made together, and behind them a dozen more dark shapes with golden hair. (ASOS, Jaime VI)

Cersei and all the other Lannisters leave Jaime alone in the dark, but Brienne rushes at his side:

From behind came a great splash. Jaime whirled toward the sound … but the faint light revealed only Brienne of Tarth, her hands bound in heavy chains. "I swore to keep you safe,” the wench said stubbornly. “I swore an oath.” Naked, she raised her hands to Jaime. “Ser. Please. If you would be so good.”

The steel links parted like silk. “A sword,” Brienne begged, and there it was, scabbard, belt, and all. She buckled it around her thick waist. The light was so dim that Jaime could scarcely see her, though they stood a scant few feet apart. In this light she could almost be a beauty, he thought. In this light she could almost be a knight. Brienne’s sword took flame as well, burning silvery blue. The darkness retreated a little more. (ASOS Jaime VI)

 This dream instigates Jaime to come to Brienne’s rescue, but as always with GRRM it might also hint at a later fulfilment. GRRM likes his threes, and since Jaime realises “creatures, hidden deep… in the waters.” – a line that is also used for the threat to Hardhome in the books  –  , I think it is possible that Jaime and Brienne will fight against wights. The third fulfilment of this prophetic dream would be if all Lannisters are dead and Brienne and Jaime stay behind. And of course the dream foreshadows the giving of oathkeeper.

 Sunglasses Symbolism of Jaime’s loss of hand

The loss of his hand stands also for his disconnection to Cersei: He was born holding her ankle, and now his hand is lost, their toxic relation comes to an end, leaving place for character development:

“And Jaime and I are more than brother and sister. We are one person in two bodies. We shared a womb together. He came into this world holding my foot, our old maester said. When he is in me, I feel … whole.“ The ghost of a smile flitted over her lips. (AGOT, Eddard XII)

This connection is torn apart:

Jaime pushed her [Cersei] away with the stump of his right hand. "No. Not here, I said.” He forced himself to stand. (ASOS, Jaime IX)

That road led nowhere, though. Jaime’s sword hand was gone, and so was he, vanished with the woman Brienne somewhere in the riverlands. (ADWD, Cersei II)

Also, I think the irony of a hand without a hand would be great, and it is interesting that Jaime’s arc is about finding new purpose/new life aims after he has lost his sword hand:

Can it be? They took my sword hand. Was that all I was, a sword hand? …  They had taken his hand, they had taken his sword hand, and without it he was nothing. The other was no good to him. Since the time he could walk, his left arm had been his shield arm, no more. It was his right hand that made him a knight; his right arm that made him a man. (ASOS, Jaime IV)

He slowly takes up the challenge to cope without a hand, and this happens at the same time, as his disconnection from Cersei and him growing closer to Brienne:

 My duty, now. Once he learned to write with his left hand, that is. (ASOS, Jaime VIII)

If the late Ser Jacelyn Bywater could wear an iron hand, he should have a gold one. (ASOS, Jaime VIII)

Please note the mention of Ser Jacelyn Bywater here! The knight without a hand who had prominent role in Tyrion’s arc in ACOK.

It is telling that he seems to accept the loss of his hand when he gives Brienne the sword that was forged from ice:

“Nor I. There was a time that I would have given my right hand to wield a sword like that. Now it appears I have, so the blade is wasted on me. Take it.” Before she could think to refuse, he went on. “A sword so fine must bear a name. It would please me if you would call this one Oathkeeper. One more thing. The blade comes with a price.” (ASOS, Jaime IX)

After Brienne has gone, Jaime adjusts to his new golden hand.

“My lord,” the lad asked, “will you be wanting your new hand?”…  The lad fetched it straightaway. The hand was wrought of gold, very lifelike, with inlaid nails of mother-of-pearl, its fingers and thumb half closed so as to slip around a goblet’s stem. I cannot fight, but I can drink, Jaime reflected as the lad was tightening the straps that bound it to his stump. “Men shall name you Goldenhand from this day forth, my lord,” the armorer had assured him the first time he’d fitted it onto Jaime’s wrist. He was wrong. I shall be the Kingslayer till I die. (AFFC, Jaime III)

He might be wrong about that… He even wishes he’d be wrong about that. He hates the name Kingslayer.

No Wodes appeared, nor any of their smallfolk, though some outlaws had taken shelter in the root cellar beneath the second brother’s keep. One of them wore the ruins of a crimson cloak, but Jaime hanged him with the rest. It felt good. This was justice. Make a habit of it, Lannister, and one day men might call you Goldenhand after all. Goldenhand the Just. . (AFFC, Jaime III)

So, if Jaime is led by Brienne to Lady Stoneheard he might be on his way to justice, since Arya is headed there as well and her arc of mercy, revenge and justice will come to closure there.

9) Jaime’s prayer for a new hand (might be fulfilled)

If you take all the times he wishes for a new Hand as foreshadowing that he will be Hand and that his wish will be fulfilled with a twist, all these hints become quite interesting. It might be a twist on the “Be carefuly what you wish for, because you might get it.

 If the Father above came down to offer him back his son or his hand, Jaime knew which he would choose. He had a second son, after all, and seed enough for many more. If Cersei wants another child I’ll give her one … and this time I’ll hold him, and the Others take those who do not like it. Robert was rotting in his grave, and Jaime was sick of lies.(ASOS, Jaime VII)

I can hardly dress myself in the morning. Jaime held up the hand in question for his father’s inspection. “Four fingers, a thumb, much like the other. Why shouldn’t it work as well?” “Good.” His father sat. “That is good. I have a gift for you. For your return. After Varys told me …” “Unless it’s a new hand, let it wait. (ASOS, Jaime VII)

 "No. But the Warrior will give you courage, the Smith will lend you strength, and the Crone will give you wisdom.” “It’s a hand I need.” The seven gods loomed above carved altars, the dark wood gleaming in the candlelight. A faint smell of incense hung in the air. “You sleep down here?” (AFFC, Jaime IV)

10) Ser Davos as a version of Jaime as Hand

Last not least, there is Ser Davos, the Hand who cannot read and write and who has shortened fingers. Some of his chapters might point towards Jaime:

“But … I cannot read … nor write …” “Maester Pylos can read for you. As to writing, my last Hand wrote the head off his shoulders. All I ask of you are the things you’ve always given me. Honesty. Loyalty. Service.” (ASOS, Davos, IV)

Jaime has to learn writing again and the show gave him dyslexia.

Davos reflected on those words as he climbed the steps of Sea Dragon Tower to the maester’s chambers below the rookery. He did not need Salla to tell him that he had risen too high. I cannot read, I cannot write, the lords despise me, I know nothing of ruling, how can I be the King’s Hand? I belong on the deck of a ship, not in a castle tower…..

He had said as much to Maester Pylos. “You are a notable captain,” the maester replied. “A captain rules his ship, does he not? He must navigate treacherous waters, set his sails to catch the rising wind, know when a storm is coming and how best to weather it. This is much the same.” (ASOS, Davos V)

Here we do have the explicit connection of the Hand as a ruler who is like a captain of a ship, and this might tie to the small hint in Jaime’s first PoV chapter.

When it came to books, Davos was more a child than any of them. Yet he persisted. He was the King’s Hand now, and a King’s Hand should read. (ASOS, Davos V)

Well, Jaime can read…..

“The man’s head and hands have been mounted above the walls of White Harbor. Lord Wyman avows this, and the Freys confirm. They have seen the head there, with an onion in its mouth. And the hands, one marked by his shortened fingers.”(AFFC, Cersei V)

The reader’s  attention is drawn again to the Hand/hand connection and the irony of a Hand without hands. At this point we do not know that Davos is not dead. So, we must assume that Stannis Hand lost his hands, not one but even two.

There is also one very intriguing connection between Davos and the Lannister siblings:

 "The Hand has lost his tongue, it seems. He has no taste for sister’s stew, or truth.“ Lord Godric wiped his mouth. (ADWD, Davos I)

So, after everything I said about the connected Lannister story arc’s it is interesting, that in this sentence there is a foreshadowing for Tyrion losing his tongue and for Jaime cutting his ties to his sister.

And there is yet another connection in the Davos PoV chapters:

The plump woman on the stool rolled her eyes. "An admiral without ships, a hand without fingers, in service to a king without a throne. Is this a knight who comes before us, or the answer to a child’s riddle?” (ADWD, Davos III)

What about a Hand without a hand? A knight as well, Ser Jaime is a knight, and there is again the allusion to ships.

Davos sat beside his candle and looked at the letters he had scratched out word by word during the days of his confinement. I was a better smuggler than a knight, he had written to his wife, a better knight than a King’s Hand, a better King’s Hand than a husband. (ADWD, Davos IV)

Here it gets very tinfoily, but what if Jaime went from knight to King’s Hand to husband?

11) Ser Jacelyn Bywater as foreshadowing

And there is Ser Jacelyn Bywater, called Iron-hand, whose Ironhand inspires Jaime to wear a gilded hand on his stump:

Lord Janos Slynt took a gulp of wine and sloshed it around in his mouth for a moment before swallowing. “Bywater. Well. Brave man, to be sure, yet … he’s rigid, that one. A queer dog. The men don’t like him. A cripple too, lost his hand at Pyke, that’s what got him knighted. A poor trade, if you ask me, a hand for a ser.” He laughed. “Ser Jacelyn thinks overmuch of himself and his honor, as I see it. You’ll do better leaving that one where he is, my lor—Tyrion. Allar Deem’s the man for you.” (ACOK, Tyrion II)

A hand for a Hand perhaps in Jaime’s case? I don’t think it is coincidence that Jacelyn Bywater had an Iron hand and changed a hand for a ser. Jaime has a golden Hand and changes his right hand for a chain of office?

It is also a strange connection that Jacelyn Bywater is the person who arrests Janos Slynt, the man who took Eddard’s head off. He is responsible that Janos Slynt is delivered to the Wall where he meets his end by Jon Snow’s hand. Will Jaime in the future be responsible for another revenge of House Stark? Will Jaime deliver the Freys to the non-existing mercy of Lady Stoneheart? I think a Red Wedding 2.0. and Jaime’s involvement is feasible.

12) Tying up multiple threads in the books

So, I never expected to find so much, when I delved into the books again….

There is also other hints that might make Jaime as Hand of the King a nice tie up for the diverse threads of the books.

I already mentioned the strange connection the Lannister PoV’s have with the motive of the hand. It would be great irony if of the three siblings it would be Jaime who would end up involved in ruling the realm, a job he never wanted, and several people think him unfit off, when it was always Cersei and Tyrion who wanted to rule.
There is also the function of Jaime’s loss of hand in his arc: He loses his greatest ability, has to work to get new abilities. He loses his connection to Cersei and gets a closer connection to Brienne, he loses the hand that made him the most dishonourable man in the 7 Kingdoms, the Kingslayer. What if the loss of his dishonour means that he will earn honour?
There is Jaime’s dream at the weirwood, which could point towards him being the last of the Lannisters, with only Brienne at his side. The impact of the dream could come in one of GRRM’s threes: 1. Jaime rescues Brienne 2. Brienne and Jaime fight against the Others. 3. Brienne rescues Jaime when he has lost all his family, maybe – dare I voice my secret wish? – even ending up married.
or which king will Jaime be the Hand?
This is a matter of simply reducing the candidates. He won’t be a Hand for Cersei. That is pretty clear from AFFC and from the show as well. Jaime has cut his connection to Cersei.
Could he be a Hand for Da€nerys? Well, I don’t believe that Da€nerys will survive, but apart from that at least showwise Tyrion is already her hand and it would be strange if she switched to Jaime of all men, the man who killed her father. Also, in the show it was pretty clear in episode 4 of season 7 that Jaime and Da€nerys are not on the same side – however you interpret the field of fire 2.0.
So, the only option is Jon. I think that would be neat for several reasons. Jaime and Jon have a lot of parallels (which makes me always wonder why only a few people ship them) and it would be a nice twist if these two who have lived with the possibility of death for a long time, would be confronted with the necessity to live to fulfil their duty. Both do not seem to be the type for rebuilding after the war, but if Jon indeed loses an eye and Jaime having already lost a hand, they might be the wounded who take on the task to plant trees.
It would also be neat because it would tie the Lannister- Targaryen connection in a way that would refer back to Robert’s rebellion. Aerys – Tywin, Daenerys – Tyrion and finally – third time being the charm – Jon and Jaime.
If this happens after a third Great Council that also sets up some changes in how the seven kingdoms are run, it would be really nice wrap.
I think it would also be great end for Jaime’s arc because it would mean that he would have a chance to continue the Lannister line, but only if he gave up the methods that have defined Lannister politics until now. It would also mean, that after the War for the Dawn the remaining parties would have to find a way to live with each other and find a compromise. This would also be very realistic. The Stark-Lannister conflict that started the series would end with a chance for reconciliation. If Jaime happens to marry someone who is a known Stark loyalist (cough, cough, any candidates come to mind?), that would bode well for the future. If Jon in addition has a queen who is also a ‘slow learner’, that would make it perfect.

# 82
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За мен ако затрият Джон шоуто приключва..всички други са ми все тая

# 83
  • Вестерос
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Според мен ще умрат всички без Санса, Аря и Тирион. Джон го виждам пътник, загинал геройски в епична битка. Дани и драконите ще умрат също. За Аря не съм сигурна също. Магията ще изчезне- чада, дракони, Другите , Мелисандра и сие... И ще  дадат след много , много години някъде скрито драконово яйце при пожар как се пропуква Grinning Grinning

# 84
  • Мнения: 403
И Тирион е пътник, съжалявам....

# 85
  • Вестерос
  • Мнения: 39 258
За какво съжаляваш? Това са си наши разсъждения как виждаме нещата.

# 86
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Смятам, че Мартин през цялото време готви двама от своите герои за крал и кралица - единият е Джон. Аз също смятах,че Джон ще умре геройски и това е неговата роля, но е клише - месията се жертва. А Мартин е разбивач на клишета. Smiley Да не говорим, че вече го уби - той и като част от Нощния страж можеше да си изиграе ролята;и като дезертьор, и като копеле ... явно на автора му трябва жив законен принц Таргариен, който бавно се изкачва от ниския статут на копеле по социалната стълбица, а по пътя е научил много (Нед, Старият мечок, майстер Емон, Корин Полуръка, Манс, Станис). А думите, с които Варис описва перфектния крал в последната книга, се съотнасят идеално към Джон.
 
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И е подготвян да управлява още отпреди да проходи. Беше обучен в оръжия, както подобава на рицар, но с това образованието му не свършва. Чете и пише, говори няколко езика, изучил е история, закон и поезия. Септа го е въвела в мистериите на Вярата, откакто стана достатъчно голям, за да ги разбира. Живял е с прости рибари, работил е с ръцете си, плувал е в реки и е кърпил мрежи, и се е научил сам да си пере дрехите, щом се наложи. Може да лови риба и да готви, и да превърже рана, знае какво означава да си гладен, да си преследван, да си уплашен. Томен беше учен, че кралството е негово право. Егон знае, че кралството е негов дълг, че един крал трябва да поставя на първо място народа си и да живее и управлява заради поданиците си.

Очаквам да видим нова версия на мъдрия крал Джеерис и добрата кралица Алисан (алитерацията е поразитена!).
И да не забравяме, че авторът е вдъхновен от Войната на розите,а тя завършва в брак и мъдро царуване на Хенри 7  и Елизабет Йорк:
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# 87
  • Варна
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Just saying...  Whistling

# 88
  • Мнения: 8 578
Напълно съм съгласна относно Джон.
Вече умря веднъж, не вярвам пак да го убият или да се жертва.И аз го виждам като крал накрая, но при Мартин нищо не се знае,сигурна съм ,че в книгите ще има повече врътки,отколкото в сериала.
Имам чувството, че Тирион и Церсей сключиха някакво споразумение и излезели наяве ще го набедят за предател.

# 89
  • Мнения: 403
Казах го шеговито, какво се засягаш?

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